[ ARC forum 2 ]
Written by Jim at 06 Dec 2001 02:23:55: Thanks
As an answer to: Re: Where do you get these ideas? written by Richard at 05 Dec 2001 20:04:07:
I suppose in some parts of religious America, masturbation is still considered sinful and this can be a problem. But think of it this way: you have a medical problem. And when you have a medical problem it's a good idea to consult a doctor. Especially if you're bleeding. A huge proportion of people (more than 90%) masturbates. If so, we're all damned to hell. (Note to religious types: I'm a Brit, I don't know the social mores of the Bible Belt first-hand. So to speak).
>>>Hope that helps. I certainly recognise that the psychological barriers to changing things can be greater than the physical ones. And it is easy to talk yourself into the position where you get to think "this isn't ever going to change; I'm going to be stuck in celibacy for the rest of my days". Well, you can join a monastery, but that's not for all of us. So you have to take positive action to change things to how you'd like them to be.
>>>Richard
>>As an American Christian who understands exactly what Christianity means and not one who has merely donned a title, and as one who understands the Bible, I am perplexed by your perception that Americans are somehow living under a shadow. Exactly what gives you this notion, and where is this Bible Belt of which you speak?
>>I've had the good fortune of visiting various parts of the US, nearly corner to crner and in between, and I'm at a loss to understand your statement.
>Hi Jim
>Sorry, I didn't mean to cause any offence!
>I was simply trying to anticipate some of the worries of the previous poster. Perhaps I overstated things. The impression from this side of the Pond is that there are some parts of the USA, mostly in the South, where religion has a firmer hold on social mores than here in the UK. Maybe it's stretching a point to think that this might condition some young people to think that masturbation is morally wrong, and any personal problems arising from that are retribution for sin.
>This very definitely isn't a diatribe against Christianity. If you want my personal opinion, I'm against any religion that has historically frowned upon the free expression of an individual's sexuality. And included in that is the tradition within Judaism and Islam of cutting off a boy infant's foreskin as a matter of course. And before anyone starts flaming me, yes I do realise that not all Jews and Muslims go through this. But it seems to me that one cannot oppose female clitoridectomy in Africa and Asia (where it occurs) without, consistently, opposing infant circumcision in the United States (or wherever).
>I hope that makes sense.
>RichardOK, that does makes more sense, and I did not take offense to your statement, just curious.
I haven't visited the South except for the state of Florida which is heavily populated with rich Jews from New York, so I really couldn't tell you if people are truly different or not. Having been to Dallas, Waco, Houston and Galveston, Texas, I can say they are much friendlier and open than those in most other parts of the country, but I certainly didn't notice that they live particularly differently from others. They certainly have their share of nightclubs and bars, so I really doubt satisfying the appetite of sex would be any worse to them than drinking.
Within Christianity there are sects which have devised all manner of rules which serve the peculiar needs of the leaders of those sects by keeping the adherents in a constant state of guilt. In the vernacular, a few are loosely grouped as "Holy Rollers", from their practice of dancing and carrying on under the guise of being smitten by the spirit. Trust me, they have no qualms about carrying on affairs behind other's backs. Some of the more well known televangelists who were caught in recent times are of that persuasion. I highly doubt anyone doing such would be trying to convince his son not to play with himself. No church I have ever attended has preached any such nonsense.
One very true fact about Americans is that there is no average Joe. In my city alone, the public schools boast of having children speaking some 90+ different languages. As you can imagine, the faces also come in that many varieties. Within that sort of diversity, God only knows how many different views there might be regarding masturbation!
I hope that will clear up some of your ideas about us. As an American, I can tell you that we do not live in fear of each other and it is not violent here as many would think. Those I have met from other countries freely share their love for my country and many would consider it to become their home.